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#1: ActivePerl 822 and Windows GUI look/feel

Posted on 2008-04-20 07:55:37 by David Christensen

activeperl:

I am attempting to build a GUI application on XP using ActivePerl 822.
It is required that I use/ configure widgets that match the look and
feel of native Win32 controls (exactly, or very nearly so). I've played
with several GUI toolkit/ framework choices:

Tk
Win32::GUI
Prima
Wx

Of the four, Tk seems to be the best documented and the defacto standard
for Perl GUI development. Both of these factors are also very
important. Also, at some point in the future, the code may be ported to
Unix, Linux, *BSD, Mac, etc., which pretty much rules out Win32::GUI (as
I understand it).


After choosing Tk, I've prototyped some code with windows, menus,
labels, edit boxes, and combo boxes. I immediately ran into problems
with combo boxes. I've tried the following Perl/Tk widgets, but have
been unable to match native Win32 look and/ or feel:

BrowseEntry
JBrowseEntry
JComboBox


I am hoping that there is an Perl/Tk widget supported by ActivePerl that
I can configure and/or tweak to mimic a Win32 combo box precisely.


Any suggestions?


TIA,

David

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#2: Re: ActivePerl 822 and Windows GUI look/feel

Posted on 2008-04-20 09:20:11 by Octavian Rasnita

If you need your application to look and feel like a Windows native
application, the only choices as far as I know are WxPerl and Win32::GUI.
If you also need it to be portable, it remains WxPerl.

WxPerl uses the OS native GUI, the Win32 API under Windows, so the program
widgets will look the same like other Windows apps.
Because of this, under Windows, only the programs created with WxPerl and
Win32::GUI are also accessible for the screen readers used by the blind,
while Tk applications are not accessible at all.
So anything you do, the Tk applications won't "look and feel" like Windows
apps for everyone.

There is very few documentation for WxPerl, but there is more documentation
for wxWidgets in general, or for WxPython, so if you know C (or even if you
don't), you can follow the wxWidgets documentation for C and you will know
what you will need to do.
I have a .chm file with the WxPerl documentation but unfortunately it was
not updated for a long time, and I can read in very many places that "this
method is not available in WxPerl" although this is not always true, but the
WxPerl mailing list members were very helpful to make the things clear.

Octavian

----- Original Message -----
From: "David Christensen" <dpchrist@holgerdanske.com>
To: <activeperl@listserv.ActiveState.com>
Sent: Sunday, April 20, 2008 8:55 AM
Subject: ActivePerl 822 and Windows GUI look/feel


> activeperl:
>
> I am attempting to build a GUI application on XP using ActivePerl 822.
> It is required that I use/ configure widgets that match the look and
> feel of native Win32 controls (exactly, or very nearly so). I've played
> with several GUI toolkit/ framework choices:
>
> Tk
> Win32::GUI
> Prima
> Wx
>
> Of the four, Tk seems to be the best documented and the defacto standard
> for Perl GUI development. Both of these factors are also very
> important. Also, at some point in the future, the code may be ported to
> Unix, Linux, *BSD, Mac, etc., which pretty much rules out Win32::GUI (as
> I understand it).
>
>
> After choosing Tk, I've prototyped some code with windows, menus,
> labels, edit boxes, and combo boxes. I immediately ran into problems
> with combo boxes. I've tried the following Perl/Tk widgets, but have
> been unable to match native Win32 look and/ or feel:
>
> BrowseEntry
> JBrowseEntry
> JComboBox
>
>
> I am hoping that there is an Perl/Tk widget supported by ActivePerl that
> I can configure and/or tweak to mimic a Win32 combo box precisely.
>
>
> Any suggestions?
>
>
> TIA,
>
> David
>
> _______________________________________________
> ActivePerl mailing list
> ActivePerl@listserv.ActiveState.com
> To unsubscribe: http://listserv.ActiveState.com/mailman/mysubs

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#3: RE: ActivePerl 822 and Windows GUI look/feel

Posted on 2008-04-20 16:46:15 by David Christensen

Octavian Rasnita wrote:
> If you need your application to look and feel like a Windows native
> application, the only choices as far as I know are WxPerl and
> Win32::GUI. If you also need it to be portable, it remains WxPerl.

Thank you for replying. :-)


I've been kicking this one around for many years, trying to find a good
GUI toolkit that is multiplatform, well designed/ documented, and
preferably Perl. Along the way, I've made a couple of explorations of
C#, .NET, etc.. The recently free VCSEE 2005 and 2008 tools are
tempting lures, as are the many C#, .NET, CLR, WinForms, etc., books.
Unfortunately, very few M$ centric books tend to be of the caliber I
desire. I am also leery of mono after experiencing other OSS
implementations of M$ technologies. I do see the advantages of C#, but
Perl is still my preferred language. My requirement for free/OSS
precludes ActiveState's Perl Development Kit and PerlNET. It's a
tangled morass, with no clear winner.


Another idea for meeting my previously unstated need for a stand-alone
GUI application (e.g. no Internet connection) would be a self-contained
web application and server running on localhost. I use WampServer for
Drupal testing, and it works very nicely. It's been a few years since I
played with Apache/ *SQL/ Perl, but do recall that HTML controls were
very primitive and the end result was orders of magnitude slower than a
native GUI. Are there better WWW controls for Apache/ Perl/ CGI/
mod_perl now? Any thoughts on AJAX?


TIA,

David

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ActivePerl@listserv.ActiveState.com
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#4: Re: ActivePerl 822 and Windows GUI look/feel

Posted on 2008-04-20 16:57:59 by Foo JH

I've mucked around with wxPerl for a while some time back. It's a good
platform if you're keen to code in Perl. Documentation is not likely to
be in wxPerl format, but it'll be quite compatible.

Your biggest challenge will be that you will experience a fairly steep
learning curve. After that, life is good. Your contribution to the
documentation will be very helpful.

David Christensen wrote:
> activeperl:
>
> I am attempting to build a GUI application on XP using ActivePerl 822.
> It is required that I use/ configure widgets that match the look and
> feel of native Win32 controls (exactly, or very nearly so). I've played
> with several GUI toolkit/ framework choices:
>
> Tk
> Win32::GUI
> Prima
> Wx
>
> Of the four, Tk seems to be the best documented and the defacto standard
> for Perl GUI development. Both of these factors are also very
> important. Also, at some point in the future, the code may be ported to
> Unix, Linux, *BSD, Mac, etc., which pretty much rules out Win32::GUI (as
> I understand it).
>
>
> After choosing Tk, I've prototyped some code with windows, menus,
> labels, edit boxes, and combo boxes. I immediately ran into problems
> with combo boxes. I've tried the following Perl/Tk widgets, but have
> been unable to match native Win32 look and/ or feel:
>
> BrowseEntry
> JBrowseEntry
> JComboBox
>
>
> I am hoping that there is an Perl/Tk widget supported by ActivePerl that
> I can configure and/or tweak to mimic a Win32 combo box precisely.
>
>
> Any suggestions?
>
>
> TIA,
>
> David
>
> _______________________________________________
> ActivePerl mailing list
> ActivePerl@listserv.ActiveState.com
> To unsubscribe: http://listserv.ActiveState.com/mailman/mysubs
>

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#5: Re: ActivePerl 822 and Windows GUI look/feel

Posted on 2008-04-20 17:19:54 by Octavian Rasnita

Yes there are now many Javascript libraries that can allow creating many
controls in a web application, but they cannot compare with a native desktop
GUI.

They can be used pretty well with a mouse, but some of them are very hard or
not accessible at all with a keyboard.

You might want to search for Prototype, Scriptaculous, DOJO, JQuery, ExtJS,
MochiKit, YUI.

Octavian

----- Original Message -----
From: "David Christensen" <dpchrist@holgerdanske.com>
To: <activeperl@listserv.ActiveState.com>
Cc: "'Octavian Rasnita'" <orasnita@gmail.com>
Sent: Sunday, April 20, 2008 5:46 PM
Subject: RE: ActivePerl 822 and Windows GUI look/feel


> Octavian Rasnita wrote:
>> If you need your application to look and feel like a Windows native
>> application, the only choices as far as I know are WxPerl and
>> Win32::GUI. If you also need it to be portable, it remains WxPerl.
>
> Thank you for replying. :-)
>
>
> I've been kicking this one around for many years, trying to find a good
> GUI toolkit that is multiplatform, well designed/ documented, and
> preferably Perl. Along the way, I've made a couple of explorations of
> C#, .NET, etc.. The recently free VCSEE 2005 and 2008 tools are
> tempting lures, as are the many C#, .NET, CLR, WinForms, etc., books.
> Unfortunately, very few M$ centric books tend to be of the caliber I
> desire. I am also leery of mono after experiencing other OSS
> implementations of M$ technologies. I do see the advantages of C#, but
> Perl is still my preferred language. My requirement for free/OSS
> precludes ActiveState's Perl Development Kit and PerlNET. It's a
> tangled morass, with no clear winner.
>
>
> Another idea for meeting my previously unstated need for a stand-alone
> GUI application (e.g. no Internet connection) would be a self-contained
> web application and server running on localhost. I use WampServer for
> Drupal testing, and it works very nicely. It's been a few years since I
> played with Apache/ *SQL/ Perl, but do recall that HTML controls were
> very primitive and the end result was orders of magnitude slower than a
> native GUI. Are there better WWW controls for Apache/ Perl/ CGI/
> mod_perl now? Any thoughts on AJAX?
>
>
> TIA,
>
> David
>

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ActivePerl@listserv.ActiveState.com
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#6: RE: ActivePerl 822 and Windows GUI look/feel

Posted on 2008-04-20 19:18:33 by Stuart Arnold

Something to look at is "TGL" which is a windows(only) way to design
windows in Perl interactivley very much like VB let syou do and it
separates the GUI from the Perl.
Its free, and is pretty good. I've created very large apps with this.
See TGL(The GUI Loft) and Perl Oasis

I am currently the maintainer to Oasis and have many fixes and
enhancements on it soon.

-----Original Message-----
From: activeperl-bounces@listserv.ActiveState.com
[mailto:activeperl-bounces@listserv.ActiveState.com] On Behalf Of David
Christensen
Sent: Sunday, April 20, 2008 10:46 AM
To: activeperl@listserv.ActiveState.com
Subject: RE: ActivePerl 822 and Windows GUI look/feel


Octavian Rasnita wrote:
> If you need your application to look and feel like a Windows native
> application, the only choices as far as I know are WxPerl and
> Win32::GUI. If you also need it to be portable, it remains WxPerl.

Thank you for replying. :-)


I've been kicking this one around for many years, trying to find a good
GUI toolkit that is multiplatform, well designed/ documented, and
preferably Perl. Along the way, I've made a couple of explorations of
C#, .NET, etc.. The recently free VCSEE 2005 and 2008 tools are
tempting lures, as are the many C#, .NET, CLR, WinForms, etc., books.
Unfortunately, very few M$ centric books tend to be of the caliber I
desire. I am also leery of mono after experiencing other OSS
implementations of M$ technologies. I do see the advantages of C#, but
Perl is still my preferred language. My requirement for free/OSS
precludes ActiveState's Perl Development Kit and PerlNET. It's a
tangled morass, with no clear winner.


Another idea for meeting my previously unstated need for a stand-alone
GUI application (e.g. no Internet connection) would be a self-contained
web application and server running on localhost. I use WampServer for
Drupal testing, and it works very nicely. It's been a few years since I
played with Apache/ *SQL/ Perl, but do recall that HTML controls were
very primitive and the end result was orders of magnitude slower than a
native GUI. Are there better WWW controls for Apache/ Perl/ CGI/
mod_perl now? Any thoughts on AJAX?


TIA,

David

_______________________________________________
ActivePerl mailing list
ActivePerl@listserv.ActiveState.com
To unsubscribe: http://listserv.ActiveState.com/mailman/mysubs

_______________________________________________
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ActivePerl@listserv.ActiveState.com
To unsubscribe: http://listserv.ActiveState.com/mailman/mysubs

Report this message

#7: Re: ActivePerl 822 and Windows GUI look/feel

Posted on 2008-04-20 21:08:29 by Octavian Rasnita

Unfortunately, unlike the VS .Net IDE, TGL is also not accessible for screen
readers... :-(

Octavian

----- Original Message -----
From: "Stuart Arnold" <stuart.arnold@comcast.net>
To: "'David Christensen'" <dpchrist@holgerdanske.com>;
<activeperl@listserv.ActiveState.com>
Sent: Sunday, April 20, 2008 8:18 PM
Subject: RE: ActivePerl 822 and Windows GUI look/feel


> Something to look at is "TGL" which is a windows(only) way to design
> windows in Perl interactivley very much like VB let syou do and it
> separates the GUI from the Perl.
> Its free, and is pretty good. I've created very large apps with this.
> See TGL(The GUI Loft) and Perl Oasis
>
> I am currently the maintainer to Oasis and have many fixes and
> enhancements on it soon.
>
> -----Original Message-----
> From: activeperl-bounces@listserv.ActiveState.com
> [mailto:activeperl-bounces@listserv.ActiveState.com] On Behalf Of David
> Christensen
> Sent: Sunday, April 20, 2008 10:46 AM
> To: activeperl@listserv.ActiveState.com
> Subject: RE: ActivePerl 822 and Windows GUI look/feel
>
>
> Octavian Rasnita wrote:
>> If you need your application to look and feel like a Windows native
>> application, the only choices as far as I know are WxPerl and
>> Win32::GUI. If you also need it to be portable, it remains WxPerl.
>
> Thank you for replying. :-)
>
>
> I've been kicking this one around for many years, trying to find a good
> GUI toolkit that is multiplatform, well designed/ documented, and
> preferably Perl. Along the way, I've made a couple of explorations of
> C#, .NET, etc.. The recently free VCSEE 2005 and 2008 tools are
> tempting lures, as are the many C#, .NET, CLR, WinForms, etc., books.
> Unfortunately, very few M$ centric books tend to be of the caliber I
> desire. I am also leery of mono after experiencing other OSS
> implementations of M$ technologies. I do see the advantages of C#, but
> Perl is still my preferred language. My requirement for free/OSS
> precludes ActiveState's Perl Development Kit and PerlNET. It's a
> tangled morass, with no clear winner.
>
>
> Another idea for meeting my previously unstated need for a stand-alone
> GUI application (e.g. no Internet connection) would be a self-contained
> web application and server running on localhost. I use WampServer for
> Drupal testing, and it works very nicely. It's been a few years since I
> played with Apache/ *SQL/ Perl, but do recall that HTML controls were
> very primitive and the end result was orders of magnitude slower than a
> native GUI. Are there better WWW controls for Apache/ Perl/ CGI/
> mod_perl now? Any thoughts on AJAX?
>
>
> TIA,
>
> David
>
> _______________________________________________
> ActivePerl mailing list
> ActivePerl@listserv.ActiveState.com
> To unsubscribe: http://listserv.ActiveState.com/mailman/mysubs
>
> _______________________________________________
> ActivePerl mailing list
> ActivePerl@listserv.ActiveState.com
> To unsubscribe: http://listserv.ActiveState.com/mailman/mysubs

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