making a gateway with eth0 wired eth1 wireless

I'm trying to make a temporary internet connection for a friend who's
moving into and apt where they provide a wireless connection. Since I'm
not sure whether she'll eventually buy a new computer or simply add
necessary parts (mainly wireless adaptor) to some older machine I have, I
want to expend a minimal amount of effort on this using stuff I have
around that's pretty much already set up. One thing I have around is an
old laptop with both wired and wireless cards (PCMCIA) that runs a Debian
variant (DamnSmalLinux). Since it's got pretty paltry resources (P1 120,
48MB RAM), I'm thinking maybe I could set it up as a sort of gateway to
route the wireless signal the apt complex offers: eth1 gets on the
wireless network and the computer routes the signal out eth0. To eth0 I
hook another desktop computer I have via crossover cable which has a wired
NIC and slightly better system resources (P2 233 96MB RAM) and runs
Ubuntu. By doing some research online and experimentation, I could maybe
eventualy figure all this out on my own. In the interest of saving me some
time working on the project, since it's a temporary thing, I'd like to
just see if I could get some suggestions and/or pointers to helpful
documentation from anyone onlist first.

I should also mention that I have a Linksys wireless B access point laying
around unused (given to me for some work I did for a friend), but so far
as I can see, this is not going to help me get her computer on the
wireless network she'll have access to. It's meant to route a wireless
signal, and has an rj45 jack on which a dhcp client runs and into which a
wired signal is to be fed, which then gets sent out the antennae to
wireless NICs within range. From documentation I've looked at, this device
can act as a bridge or can extend range in concert with a second access
point like it. But looking into this earlier, I determined I could not use
it as a sort of wireless NIC in itself, receiving a signal and routing it
back and forth through the rj45 plug. But I'm not terribly knowledgeable
about this, so maybe there is a way to use it for this project.

Input on these matters will be appreciated.

Thanks, James
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Re: making a gateway with eth0 wired eth1 wireless

At 09:03 AM 12/30/2004 -0600, James Miller wrote:

>I'm trying to make a temporary internet connection for a friend who's
>moving into and apt where they provide a wireless connection. Since I'm
>not sure whether she'll eventually buy a new computer or simply add
>necessary parts (mainly wireless adaptor) to some older machine I have, I
>want to expend a minimal amount of effort on this using stuff I have
>around that's pretty much already set up. One thing I have around is an
>old laptop with both wired and wireless cards (PCMCIA) that runs a Debian
>variant (DamnSmalLinux). Since it's got pretty paltry resources (P1 120,
>48MB RAM), I'm thinking maybe I could set it up as a sort of gateway to
>route the wireless signal the apt complex offers: eth1 gets on the
>wireless network and the computer routes the signal out eth0. To eth0 I
>hook another desktop computer I have via crossover cable which has a wired
>NIC and slightly better system resources (P2 233 96MB RAM) and runs
>Ubuntu. By doing some research online and experimentation, I could maybe
>eventualy figure all this out on my own. In the interest of saving me some
>time working on the project, since it's a temporary thing, I'd like to
>just see if I could get some suggestions and/or pointers to helpful
>documentation from anyone onlist first.

As outlined, all of this should work. But as you already seem to realize,
the devil is in the details. From what you've said, I can't really tell
what details you need help with, and trying to write a response that
explains everything you *might* need to know (or even the subset of
"everything" that I know) is simply too much work.

If there are any soup-to-nuts resources for this sort of exercise, I'd like
to know about them too ... so even suggesting for resources, it helps to
know which parts of this overall job you need help with.

So, which of these pieces of the problem do you need help with?


1. Getting the laptop connected to the wireless network? For this, fill us
in on what the apt's ISP says about how to do it (probably Windows-based
advice). No actual passwords, of couse, but be as specific as you can about
anything else. You haven't even mentioned if the wireless side is b, a, or
g. This stuff is always network specific.


2. Getting the wireless NIC working with Linux? Again, what are the
details? What kernel driver does it use (or is that what you need help
with)? And BTW, wireless NICs usually are not eth* interfaces; they usually
are (I think) wlan* interfaces.


3. Getting the laptop connected to the other workstation? This should work
out of the box, assuming you have compatible networking setups (IP address,
netmask, and so forth) on both machines. If it doesn't, please be as
specific as you can about what's not working. One thing to watch for
(whenever you use a crossover cable) is handshaking problems between the
NICs ... sometimes in these direct connections 10/100 NICs have trouble
agreeing on a speed. If you're seeing problems, try, at least for testing
purposes, using a small hub instead of the crossover cable. (You must have
an old, small hub and a couple of cables around, right? Don't we all, these
days?)


4. Getting the laptop to route? This involves three basic steps:
(a) simply turning on routing, by setting
/proc/sys/net/ipv4/ip_forward to 1.
(b) setting up routing properly in the laptop's routing table. If
DSL is close enough to Debian for my guesses abut it to work, you do this
in /etc/network/interfaces, then restart networking (/etc/init.d/networking
restart).
(c) setting up NAT if you need to. Whether you need to depends on
how the apt's ISP provides IP addresses to the system that use it; see piece 1.


5. Something else? If so, what?



>I should also mention that I have a Linksys wireless B access point laying
>around unused (given to me for some work I did for a friend), but so far
>as I can see, this is not going to help me get her computer on the
>wireless network she'll have access to. It's meant to route a wireless
>signal, and has an rj45 jack on which a dhcp client runs and into which a
>wired signal is to be fed, which then gets sent out the antennae to
>wireless NICs within range. From documentation I've looked at, this device
>can act as a bridge or can extend range in concert with a second access
>point like it. But looking into this earlier, I determined I could not use
>it as a sort of wireless NIC in itself, receiving a signal and routing it
>back and forth through the rj45 plug. But I'm not terribly knowledgeable
>about this, so maybe there is a way to use it for this project.

Since we don't know anything about the apt's wireless LAN, I hesitate to
say there is no possibility of using the Linksys device to access it. But I
can't think of a way to make it do the job you want done.




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Re: making a gateway with eth0 wired eth1 wireless

Sorry about the lack of details, Ray: it was because I already have both
interfaces working in this laptop and so don't really need help with
setting that up. If I take this laptop into an area with a wireless
network, for example, and the network has a dhcp server, I turn on the
computer, the module for the NIC loads, the dhcp client runs and I get on
the network. It's an older card--Wavelan bronze--and doesn't do encryption
of any form, I believe. The wired NIC works similarly: I plug in an
ethernet cable, fire up the computer and the NIC module loads and a dhcp
client runs on the interface to get an IP. I've never tried using both
cards at once, though. But before going on at any greater length on that,
I want to say that I'm now exploring more the Linksys access point
possibility I mentioned in my initial post. Looking over documentation
again, it seems to me like it might work and be the simpler solution. From
what I gather thus far, if I know the MAC address of the access point to
which my access point might serve as client, I might be able to use it, in
effect, as a NIC (by hooking its rj45 plug to a wired NIC in a desktop
computer). Let me append here some descriptions of the modes the access
point is capable of, excerpted from the manual:

------------BEGIN LINKSYS MANUAL EXCERPT-------------------------

SETTING THE AP MODE:
The Access Point offers five modes of operation: Access Point, Access
Point Client, Wireless Bridge, Wireless Bridge Point to MultiPoint, and
Wireless Repeater. For all bridging modes, as well as Wireless Repeater
mode, make sure the channel, SSID, and WEP keys are the same.
Note: For all modes of operation EXCEPT Access Point, the remote access
point must be a second Linksys Wireless-B Access Point (WAP11). The Access
Point will not communicate with any other kind of remote access
Access Point - The Operational Mode is set to Access Point by
default. This connects your wireless PCs to a wired network. In most
cases, no change is necessary.
Access Point Client - When set to Access Point Client mode, the Access
Point Client is able to talk to one remote access point within its range.
This mode allows the Access Point Client to act as a client of a remote
access point. The Access Point Client cannot communicate directly with any
wireless clients. A separate network attached to the Access Point Client
can then be wirelessly bridged to the remote access point. Enter the
required LAN MAC address of the remote access point in the Remote AP MAC
Address field.
Wireless Bridge - If you are trying to make a wireless connection
between two wired networks, as shown in Figure 6-5, select Wireless
Bridge. This mode connects two physically separated wired networks with
two access points.
To configure a Wireless Bridge environment, click Wireless Bridge and
enter the LAN MAC address of the remote access point in the Remote Bridge
MAC Address f ield. The remote access point also needs to be set up as a
Wireless Bridge.
Note: All devices on each wired network must be connected through a hub
or switch.
Note: In Wireless Bridge mode, the Access Point can ONLY be accessed by
another access point in Wireless Bridge mode. In order for your other
wireless devices to access the Access Point, you must reset it to Access
Point mode. The two modes are mutually exclusive.
Wireless Bridge Point to MultiPoint - If you are trying to make a
wireless connection between more than two wired networks, as shown in
Figure 6-6, select Wireless Bridge Point to MultiPoint. This mode allows
you to construct a network that has multiple access points bridging
wirelessly.
To configure a Wireless Bridge Point to MultiPoint environment, click
Wireless Bridge Point to MultiPoint for the Access Point that will connect
to multiple access points (in Figure 6-6, it is the Access Point in LAN
1).
Then, for the other bridged access points, click Wireless Bridge, and
enter the Remote Bridge MAC Address of the Access Point set to Point to
MultiPoint.
Note: Linksys recommends bridging no more than three remote LANs in
Wireless Bridge Point to MultiPoint mode. Bridging additional remote LANs
will result in a significant decrease in bandwidth.
Wireless Repeater - When set to Wireless Repeater mode, the Wireless
Repeater is able to talk to one remote access point within its range and
retransmit its signal. See Figure 6-7. To configure a Wireless Repeater
environment, click Wireless Repeater and enter the LAN MAC address of the
remote access point in the Remote AP MAC Address field.

---------------END LINKSYS MANUAL EXCERPT----------------------------

Sorry for any confusion regarding the diagrams, which I could not, of
course, include. As I am reading this, it seems to me by using access
point client mode I might be able to make a machine with a wired NIC
hooked to the rj45 jack on the Linksys access point communicate on the
wireless network in this building: the wired NIC and the Linksys access
point act in concert like a wireless NIC. Am I reading/understanding
correctly?

As for the network in the building, I know nothing about it at this point.
I assume it's some kind of cable connection that gets routed through a
wireless router, which runs a dhcp server and gives out addresses to
clients within range using class C addressing. But that's pure
speculation. I have no idea if there will be any sort of security measures
in place (e.g., authentication), but that seems something more
software-oriented, while what I'm tackling at the moment is more
hardware-oriented. Can't say anything more specific about the network
until I actually get access to it (she'll move in tomorrow).

In closing I'll just ask: shouldn't I be able to get the building's access
point's MAC address using kismet or airsnort? I'm guessing if I ask them
they'll either: 1) be so uninformed they won't have a clue; or 2) are
going to be informed and thus become suspiscious.

Thanks, James
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Re: making a gateway with eth0 wired eth1 wireless

On Thu, 30 Dec 2004, James Miller wrote:

> ------------BEGIN LINKSYS MANUAL EXCERPT-------------------------

> Note: For all modes of operation EXCEPT Access Point, the remote access
> point must be a second Linksys Wireless-B Access Point (WAP11). The Access
> Point will not communicate with any other kind of remote access

Oops. I overlooked that note this time. This is probably why I earlier
determined I could not use this thing as a wireless client: what are the
chances the network it's on is going to have exactly the same Linksys
wireless B access point? Is this really the show-stopper it seems to be,
or is this just some corporate posturing attempt to keep people from using
other companies' hardware?

James
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Re: making a gateway with eth0 wired eth1 wireless

At 11:43 AM 12/30/2004 -0600, James Miller wrote:

>Sorry about the lack of details, Ray: it was because I already have both
>interfaces working in this laptop and so don't really need help with
>setting that up. If I take this laptop into an area with a wireless
>network, for example, and the network has a dhcp server, I turn on the
>computer, the module for the NIC loads, the dhcp client runs and I get on
>the network. It's an older card--Wavelan bronze--and doesn't do encryption
>of any form, I believe.

Then the interface will probably work with the apt's WAN. You still need to
get authentication details from the provider ... it may need to know a MAC
address or have the system run something else to authenticate itself. Only
the ISP can tell you that part. But the Linux part seems to be working.

>The wired NIC works similarly: I plug in an
>ethernet cable, fire up the computer and the NIC module loads and a dhcp
>client runs on the interface to get an IP.

Well, since the other workstation probably isn't running a DHCP server,
you'll need to provide a static address here. Look in
/etc/network/interfaces and make changes like these (an example from my own
workstation).

Look for an entry like ...

auto eth0
iface eth0 inet dhcp

.... and replace it with one like (use your own addresses) ...

auto eth0
iface eth0 inet static
address 192.168.1.2
netmask 255.255.255.0
network 192.168.1.0
broadcast 192.168.1.255
# no gateway entry since this is an internal interface

Give the other workstation a compatible static address in the same way (if
it is a Debian-like Linux) or whatever way is right for it (if not).

>I've never tried using both
>cards at once, though.

You'll need to enable ip_forwarding (see my prior message). Whether you'll
need to have the router NAT or not depends entirely on what you learn from
the ISP. If yo do need to NAT, it might be worth looking at the Shorewall
drop-in firewall package to handle this for you. Or follow up here and I
can give you some of the details about the bespoke firewall I run on my router.

> But before going on at any greater length on that,
>I want to say that I'm now exploring more the Linksys access point
>possibility I mentioned in my initial post. Looking over documentation
>again, it seems to me like it might work and be the simpler solution. From
>what I gather thus far, if I know the MAC address of the access point to
>which my access point might serve as client, I might be able to use it, in
>effect, as a NIC (by hooking its rj45 plug to a wired NIC in a desktop
>computer). Let me append here some descriptions of the modes the access
>point is capable of, excerpted from the manual:
>
>------------BEGIN LINKSYS MANUAL EXCERPT-------------------------
>
> SETTING THE AP MODE:
> The Access Point offers five modes of operation: Access Point, Access
>Point Client, Wireless Bridge, Wireless Bridge Point to MultiPoint, and
>Wireless Repeater. For all bridging modes, as well as Wireless Repeater
>mode, make sure the channel, SSID, and WEP keys are the same.
> Note: For all modes of operation EXCEPT Access Point, the remote access
>point must be a second Linksys Wireless-B Access Point (WAP11). The Access
>Point will not communicate with any other kind of remote access
> Access Point - The Operational Mode is set to Access Point by
>default. This connects your wireless PCs to a wired network. In most
>cases, no change is necessary.
> Access Point Client - When set to Access Point Client mode, the Access
>Point Client is able to talk to one remote access point within its range.
>This mode allows the Access Point Client to act as a client of a remote
>access point. The Access Point Client cannot communicate directly with any
>wireless clients. A separate network attached to the Access Point Client
>can then be wirelessly bridged to the remote access point. Enter the
>required LAN MAC address of the remote access point in the Remote AP MAC
>Address field.
[rest deleted]

What you are interested in is the Access Point Client option. The
disclaimer that precedes it (and you noted in a separate e-mail) seems to
say that this option requires WAP11s on both ends. Maybe, maybe not. It
depends entirely on the details of how they did this.

If they are using some proprietary trick, then you do need WAP11s on both
ends ... proprietary extensions in WAPs like higher speeds invariably
require matching hardware on both sides. But if they have implemented a way
to make the device look like a standard Wireless-b NIC, then it should work
with anything.

There is no way to guess about this, and a Linux list is not the best place
to find expertise about non-standard uses of Linksys WAPs. Try it, or look
for a Limksys support list where you can ask.




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Re: making a gateway with eth0 wired eth1 wireless

James Miller wrote:
> I'm trying to make a temporary internet connection for a friend who's
> moving into and apt where they provide a wireless connection. Since I'm
> not sure whether she'll eventually buy a new computer or simply add
> necessary parts (mainly wireless adaptor) to some older machine I have, I
> want to expend a minimal amount of effort on this using stuff I have
> around that's pretty much already set up. One thing I have around is an
> old laptop with both wired and wireless cards (PCMCIA) that runs a Debian
> variant (DamnSmalLinux). Since it's got pretty paltry resources (P1 120,
> 48MB RAM), I'm thinking maybe I could set it up as a sort of gateway to
> route the wireless signal the apt complex offers: eth1 gets on the
> wireless network and the computer routes the signal out eth0. To eth0 I
> hook another desktop computer I have via crossover cable which has a wired
> NIC

Dear James:

I have done something like this with a laptop with an 80486dx33
with 80 MB of RAM. I think we can drop the 'paltry resources' theme.
I slightly modified a script I found:
newbiedoc.sourceforge.net/networking/homegateway.html#IPMASQ SETTINGSETH
I recommend that you read the article so you can determine which parts
apply to your situation, if any.
http://newbiedoc.sourceforge.net/networking/homegateway.html

So,
What is the kernel version of your Debian-variant-DSL?
(I want to determine whether you can use IPCHAINS or IPTABLES.)

&, just for grins;
What is the model number of your LinkSys AP?

You need to determine how to access the local wireless network.

How big is your hard drive?
(I want to determine if you can run a more mature distribution
as I run Slackware v9.1, kernel 2.4.22, in my 80486 laptop.)

HTH, Chuck

> Input on these matters will be appreciated.
>
> Thanks, James


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Re: making a gateway with eth0 wired eth1 wireless

On Fri, 31 Dec 2004, chuck gelm wrote:

> I have done something like this with a laptop with an 80486dx33
> with 80 MB of RAM. I think we can drop the 'paltry resources' theme.

I meant paltry for a day-to-day usage machine for real-world, productivity
purposes. I know it will work fine as a sort of router: my own router,
though it has a slightly faster processor (180Mhz), has only half as much
RAM.

> I slightly modified a script I found:
> newbiedoc.sourceforge.net/networking/homegateway.html#IPMASQ SETTINGSETH
> I recommend that you read the article so you can determine which parts
> apply to your situation, if any.
> http://newbiedoc.sourceforge.net/networking/homegateway.html

Ok. Thanks for the link. I'll look it over.

> So,
> What is the kernel version of your Debian-variant-DSL?
> (I want to determine whether you can use IPCHAINS or IPTABLES.)

2.4.22.

> &, just for grins;
> What is the model number of your LinkSys AP?

WAP 11 ver 2.8. It's not the one that runs Linux, if you're wondering
about that.

> How big is your hard drive?
> (I want to determine if you can run a more mature distribution
> as I run Slackware v9.1, kernel 2.4.22, in my 80486 laptop.)

1.6GB, if I recall correctly. It's currently running Debian unstable, for
the most part. DamnSmallLinux is based on Knoppix, which is based on
Debian. After I did the install-to-hd routine, I added the unstable Debian
repositories to sources.list and did dist-upgrade, so alot of the software
on it is fairly cutting-edge. I had to leave the DSL kernel in place, and
some of the stuff is DSL-specific and must be dealt with carefully: it
uses a specially-compiled Xvesa rather than XFree86, for example, and the
display can get easily hosed by apt-get(ting) the wrong X package(s).

James
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Re: making a gateway with eth0 wired eth1 wireless

James Miller wrote:
> On Fri, 31 Dec 2004, chuck gelm wrote:
>
>
>> I have done something like this with a laptop with an 80486dx33
>>with 80 MB of RAM. I think we can drop the 'paltry resources' theme.
>
>
> I meant paltry for a day-to-day usage machine for real-world, productivity
> purposes. I know it will work fine as a sort of router: my own router,
> though it has a slightly faster processor (180Mhz), has only half as much
> RAM.
>
>
>>I slightly modified a script I found:
>>newbiedoc.sourceforge.net/networking/homegateway.html#IPMA SQSETTINGSETH
>>I recommend that you read the article so you can determine which parts
>>apply to your situation, if any.
>>http://newbiedoc.sourceforge.net/networking/homegateway.ht ml
>
>
> Ok. Thanks for the link. I'll look it over.
>
>
>>So,
>>What is the kernel version of your Debian-variant-DSL?
>> (I want to determine whether you can use IPCHAINS or IPTABLES.)
>
>
> 2.4.22.
>
>
>>&, just for grins;
>>What is the model number of your LinkSys AP?
>
>
> WAP 11 ver 2.8. It's not the one that runs Linux, if you're wondering
> about that.

Thanks. Oh. Hmmm, I've never heard of a wireless access point device
that runs linux. :-|
>
>
>>How big is your hard drive?
>> (I want to determine if you can run a more mature distribution
>> as I run Slackware v9.1, kernel 2.4.22, in my 80486 laptop.)
>
>
> 1.6GB, if I recall correctly.

Okay, you are not limited in your choice of kernel or distribution.
You are limited in RAM, so, IMHO, you are limited in your choice of GUI.
(desktop environment and Xwindow server). None of which interferes with
its ability to function as a 'gateway' and/or 'router', but only in your
choice of GUI application with which to configure the laptop.

You can use IPTABLES with kernel 2.4.x, so that article may be all the
information you need.

Good luck, Chuck

> James


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Re: making a gateway with eth0 wired eth1 wireless

At 02:18 PM 12/31/2004 -0500, chuck gelm wrote:
[...]
>>>&, just for grins;
>>>What is the model number of your LinkSys AP?
>>
>>WAP 11 ver 2.8. It's not the one that runs Linux, if you're wondering
>>about that.
>
> Thanks. Oh. Hmmm, I've never heard of a wireless access point device
>that runs linux. :-|

Do a Google search on "Linksys Linux" and follow the first link you get
back, if you are curious about this device.




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Re: making a gateway with eth0 wired eth1 wireless

Ray Olszewski wrote:
> At 02:18 PM 12/31/2004 -0500, chuck gelm wrote:
> [...]
>
>>>> &, just for grins;
>>>> What is the model number of your LinkSys AP?
>>>
>>>
>>> WAP 11 ver 2.8. It's not the one that runs Linux, if you're wondering
>>> about that.
>>
>>
>> Thanks. Oh. Hmmm, I've never heard of a wireless access point device
>> that runs linux. :-|
>
>
> Do a Google search on "Linksys Linux" and follow the first link you get
> back, if you are curious about this device.

Hi, Ray:

Thanks. Wow! LinkSys really is making it easy to use their products
with Linux. :-)

Regards, Chuck

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