Firewall newbie! Which free one??

Hi,
Skint student here so have to stick with the free firewall software.
Had a little look on google but every program is recommended in one way
or another.
I like using Zone alarm on both my computers, win 2k and xp pro.
As it tells me when something is trying to access the net, and it seems
pretty reliable to me.
So should I keep using it? Or remove it from my XP machine as it comes
with a built in firewall, but to me it does not look as good.
Any comments or suggestions would be great!

Thanks.

Re: Firewall newbie! Which free one??

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Re: Firewall newbie! Which free one??

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Re: Firewall newbie! Which free one??

mcv wrote:
> Hi,
> Skint student here so have to stick with the free firewall software.
> Had a little look on google but every program is recommended in one way
> or another.
> I like using Zone alarm on both my computers, win 2k and xp pro.
> As it tells me when something is trying to access the net, and it seems
> pretty reliable to me.
> So should I keep using it? Or remove it from my XP machine as it comes
> with a built in firewall, but to me it does not look as good.
> Any comments or suggestions would be great!
>
> Thanks.
>

I use a router w/basic firewall and the XP firewall. This suite me fine
as it is the least obtrusive setup. ZoneAlarm, Kerio etc. can notify you
of something trying to connect out that you may not want connecting out
but more serious malware can bypass the firewall so it is actually
better to use a port monitor to see what traffic is connecting in/out.
ZoneAlarm is the easiest to use but if you ant something more complete
give NetVeda Safety.Net a shot, can be a bit daunting to setup though as
it is much more than a firewall. Kerio is easy and ok too.

http://www.netveda.com/consumer/safetynet.htm

Re: Firewall newbie! Which free one??

Leythos wrote:


> Why are you always condescending to people when the come here asking
> honest questions?

Maybe he's young and needs the fun.

>
> ZoneAlarm is at least as reliable as XP's built-in port blocker, and in
> the right hands, it's more reliable.
>
>> > As it tells me when something is trying to access the net, and it seems
>> > pretty reliable to me.
>>
>> It isn't. I've seen numerous system running too fine with ZoneAlarm
>> installed, it should submit some more errors.
>
> Sure it is, [...]

ZA like all Personal-Firewalls is crap, has always been crap and will always
be crap. You know, Sebastian knows and I know.

EOD

Wolfgang

Re: Firewall newbie! Which free one??

>>>I like using Zone alarm on both my computers, win 2k and xp pro.
>>
>>So if you're not using your computers in a productive way, why do you want
>>a firewall?
>
>
> Why are you always condescending to people when the come here asking
> honest questions?
>
> ZoneAlarm is at least as reliable as XP's built-in port blocker, and in
> the right hands, it's more reliable.

LOL, you might as well ask a blind man from birth why he is blind. The
response from the blind man will be *it's just the way it is and I am
what I am.* Apparently, he don't know any better and he can't change, as
he was brought up that way.

Duane :)

Re: Firewall newbie! Which free one??

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Re: Firewall newbie! Which free one??

Leythos wrote:

> In article , wolfgang@shconnect.de says...

>> ZA like all Personal-Firewalls is crap...
> Yes, but it's still a LOT better than Windows XP Firewall.

What does "LOT" mean?

asks
Wolfgang

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Re: Firewall newbie! Which free one??

Then what kind of free firewall would you guys suggest using?

Re: Firewall newbie! Which free one??

Hallo Leythos, u wrote:

> > Leythos wrote:

> > >> ZA like all Personal-Firewalls is crap...
> > > Yes, but it's still a LOT better than Windows XP Firewall.
> >
> > What does "LOT" mean?
>
> LOT, means that it has more information for the user to determine
> access, more ability to block,

blocking incoming requests does the XP Firewall, blocking outgoing
requests isn't possible at all.

> and is less likely for a application to
> install a hole without the user knowing.

For that, I inform me.

Wolfgang

Re: Firewall newbie! Which free one??

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Re: Firewall newbie! Which free one??

Leythos schrieb:

> In article <867uf2h6ip7ad9ms6gd7uskehm5ro02sra@news.wolfgang.ewert.com>,
> W.Ewert2002@gmx.de says...
> > Hallo Leythos, u wrote:
> >
> > > > Leythos wrote:
> >
> > > > >> ZA like all Personal-Firewalls is crap...
> > > > > Yes, but it's still a LOT better than Windows XP Firewall.

How can crap be better than anything else?

> > > >
> > > > What does "LOT" mean?
> > >
> > > LOT, means that it has more information for the user to determine
> > > access, more ability to block,
> >
> > blocking incoming requests does the XP Firewall, blocking outgoing
> > requests isn't possible at all.
>
> Yes, it can't and doesn't do anything about outbound requests,

no personal firewall can do anything about outbound requests. At least,
Microsoft is astonishingly honest and tells you it cannot. Others claim
they can, while they cannot either.

> it also
> doesn't provide a real-time means for users to monitor connections.

You do not really want to tell us that you trust any connection
monitoring on an infected system, do you?

>
> >
> > > and is less likely for a application to
> > > install a hole without the user knowing.
> >
> > For that, I inform me.
>
> Code, by any vendor, AOL is a good example, can open a exception in the
> Windows XP Firewall without alerting the user.

It can do so with any personal firewall.

Regards
Thomas

Re: Firewall newbie! Which free one??

Thomas wrote:

> It can do so with any personal firewall.
>
> Regards
> Thomas
>

If that's true then why is so much outbound crap caught by PFW's? I
mean, if it is so easy to bypass then why aren't they all doing it? I've
seen PFW's like Kerio etc. capture lots of shit the developer wished you
didn't know about. I only use the XP firewall now as it is less
obtrusive but I have used many other firewalls in the past so know they
can stop outbound connections you might not want happening.

Re: Firewall newbie! Which free one??

Garrot wrote:
> Thomas wrote:
>
>> It can do so with any personal firewall.
>>
>> Regards
>> Thomas
>>
>
> If that's true then why is so much outbound crap caught by PFW's? I
> mean, if it is so easy to bypass then why aren't they all doing it? I've
> seen PFW's like Kerio etc. capture lots of shit the developer wished you
> didn't know about.

Like what? Can you provide an example? What developer are you talking
about? It's only stopping a program from making an outbound connection
that it can detect because it's running, which is not even a FW function
the beloved App. Control. That doesn't mean that the PFW is stopping all
outbound connections.

What about that period of time on the boot and login where malware can
and does beat the PFW out on outbound before the PFW can be started? And
I have tested most of the PFW(s) on the boot and login process and not a
one of them could stop malware from connecting out, during this time period.


>I only use the XP firewall now as it is less
> obtrusive but I have used many other firewalls in the past so know they
> can stop outbound connections you might not want happening.

And if malware can get there and can be executed, it can circumvent or
fool the PFW just like it can fool or circumvent the O/S.

If the O/S has not been hardened to attack, then nothing that's running
with the O/S is secured. And most users flat-out cannot or don't even
know how to secure the O/S. So what makes you think that some PFW is
some stops all and ends all solution when it's not that, particularly
when nothing has been done to the O/S?

A personal FW if you want to call it a FW is just a personal packet
filter. It's not a FW. A FW separates two networks the one that it's
protecting from usually the Internet and the one that it's protecting
the LAN.

Duane :)

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Re: Firewall newbie! Which free one??

Duane Arnold wrote:

> Like what? Can you provide an example?

Lexmark printer drivers spying on customers printing habits.

Ubisoft HoM&M5 spying on customers to see how many times they play the game.

Game called Swat4 that injected dynamic advertising into the game via
the internet.

Is that enough for you or do you want the whole fucking list? And I
never said a PFW can block everything, I made that quite clear in fact!
Learn to read.

Re: Firewall newbie! Which free one??

Garrot wrote:
> Duane Arnold wrote:
>
>> Like what? Can you provide an example?
>
>
> Lexmark printer drivers spying on customers printing habits.

I consider it to be useless paranoia.

>
> Ubisoft HoM&M5 spying on customers to see how many times they play the
> game.
>
They installed it they have to suffer the consequences. And besides, the
software developer is not hiding anything to begin with.

> Game called Swat4 that injected dynamic advertising into the game via
> the internet.

They installed it. So see above.

>
> Is that enough for you or do you want the whole fucking list? And I
> never said a PFW can block everything, I made that quite clear in fact!

No you didn't. All you did is post some crap about a PFW and how great
it is when it is not that great and can beaten. You didn't make a damn
thing clear about anything.


And since you needed to get out of line here, you take your computer
running the God Damn PFW and stick it right up your fucking ass.


> Learn to read.

I read alright only to find out that you're a dumbass home user running
off about the your stupid mouth and some persoanl packet filter.

Duane

Re: Firewall newbie! Which free one??

Leythos wrote:
> In article , "Do
> forget about it"@PleaeDo.BET says...
>
>>It's only stopping a program from making an outbound connection
>>that it can detect because it's running, which is not even a FW function
>>the beloved App. Control. That doesn't mean that the PFW is stopping all
>>outbound connections.
>
>
> Actually, I don't care about app control, I care about port control, and
> I want the PFW to tell me what is in/out in real time.
>

But many home users do consider AC as part of some FW function when it's
not. I consider what you're talking about to be part of a packet
filtering solution.

Duane :)

Re: Firewall newbie! Which free one??

Leythos schrieb:

> In article <1157662324.986154.297760@p79g2000cwp.googlegroups.com>,
> thomas.hertel@gmx.net says...

> > no personal firewall can do anything about outbound requests. At least,
> > Microsoft is astonishingly honest and tells you it cannot. Others claim
> > they can, while they cannot either.
>
> There are zillions of people that will tell you they can track outbound
> connections with their PFW solutions and they would be correct.

OK, they can track outbound connections of programs that allow the PFW
to control them. But what about all the others? Using a PFW is like
having a police that is only capable of arresting criminals who show up
in their office and tell them what they=B4ve just done.

> We all
> know they are not perfect, but, they offer more information than Windows
> XP Firewall, and information is power.

Information is power if and only if you have the entire information.
But this is exactly what you won=B4t get from a PFW.

As an example, Volker Birk has published a PoC to show how you can
easily fool PFWs. His source code is available at
http://www.dingens.org/breakout-wp.cpp. And yes, that obviously works
with any PFW. A similiar PoC for ZA is available at
http://hackingspirits.com/vuln-rnd/vuln-rnd.html

So seeing all these nice alerts a PFW generates will give you a cosy
feeling of being safe while this one piece of software that it didn=B4t
detect is just busy tunnelling your personal data to a remote server
using your trusted browser of choice.

> > > it also
> > > doesn't provide a real-time means for users to monitor connections.
> >
> > You do not really want to tell us that you trust any connection
> > monitoring on an infected system, do you?
>
> No, absolutely not, but I trust monitoring on an uncompromised system.

Why would you want to do that? On an uncompromised system you will only
have outbound connections that you initiated. Why monitor them? If you
have unwanted outbound connections then your system is compromised and
you cannot trust any piece of software running on it.

> > > Code, by any vendor, AOL is a good example, can open a exception in t=
he
> > > Windows XP Firewall without alerting the user.
> >
> > It can do so with any personal firewall.
>
> Prove it - provide me a sample for testing against various PFW
> solutions. Have your proof enter a PORT 80 inbound exception in 4
> different popular PFW's and it should also do the same in Windows XP
> Firewall (so 5 in total). Send the sample (and source code) to my email
> address (in sig) and I'll report back the findings.

Sorry, I am not a programmer. Others can certainly do better on that
than I. But it is pretty obvious that a piece of software running with
admin privileges can alter all settings of the OS or any applications
without notifying the user. As a very common example, Windows Update
does this all the time.

Regards
Thomas

Re: Firewall newbie! Which free one??

Blue wrote:

> Then what kind of free firewall would you guys suggest using?

I suggest using the following parts for a firewalling concept:

* work & surf as a normal user (not as an administrator)
* use trustworthy software (don't use the internet explorer for surfing the
internet & OE for reading e-mail)
* keep your system & software up-to-date
* backup your data (your system) periodically
* don't offer services you don't need

These are the main points.

* if you are unsure about software and files you got, use a virusscanner
* you may also block unwanted traffic with a spam filter (in combination
with a virus scanner) for mail & with a adware blocker for web traffic
(privoxy, proxomitron or adblock+ f.e.) & a packet filter like the xp
firewall or ipfw (BSD, windows 2k) or netfilter.org (iptables)

A good think is to separate these parts from the working machine to a
purpose-built "Bastion Host" (gateway, "hardware" firewall,...)

* you'll inspect your system with some tools from sysinternals.com (only for
windows) and your network traffic with the help of sniffers (wireshark,
former known as ethereal) and/or intrusion detection systems like snort.

The precise configuration depends on what you're doing and what you want.

HTH
Are some points missing?
Wolfgang

Re: Firewall newbie! Which free one??

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Re: Firewall newbie! Which free one??

Leythos wrote:

> thomas.hertel@gmx.net says...

>> But it is pretty obvious that a piece of software running with
>> admin privileges can alter all settings of the OS or any applications
>> without notifying the user. As a very common example, Windows Update
>> does this all the time.
>
> So what all this comes down too is that you are basing all of your
> ideals

It hasn't has to do with ideals, it's a fundamental conclusion in using
networks (particularly using IP connections).

> on what others have told you because you don't have any means to
> prove or disprove them.

Thomas showed you a proof (of concept) and you ignore it? Did you disprove
the PoC "breakout-wp"?

> Windows firewall is just plain crap, it permits applications to make
> exceptions without notification,

Exceptions for inbound or for outbond traffic? The windows firewall can
block inbound traffic, but neither this tool or other tools can't
completely control outbound traffic (unless you block *all* traffic
completely).

> something most of the PFW solutions don't allow for.

See above.

Wolfgang

Re: Firewall newbie! Which free one??

Leythos schrieb:

> In article <1157704969.837298.228960@m79g2000cwm.googlegroups.com>,
> thomas.hertel@gmx.net says...
> > > Prove it - provide me a sample for testing against various PFW
> > > solutions. Have your proof enter a PORT 80 inbound exception in 4
> > > different popular PFW's and it should also do the same in Windows XP
> > > Firewall (so 5 in total). Send the sample (and source code) to my ema=
il
> > > address (in sig) and I'll report back the findings.
> >
> > Sorry, I am not a programmer. Others can certainly do better on that
> > than I. But it is pretty obvious that a piece of software running with
> > admin privileges can alter all settings of the OS or any applications
> > without notifying the user. As a very common example, Windows Update
> > does this all the time.
>
> So what all this comes down too is that you are basing all of your
> ideals on what others have told you because you don't have any means to
> prove or disprove them.

Why did I know you=B4d say that? Is it really necessary to know every
bit by name in order to be able to judge very basic concepts? Isn=B4t it
enough if the proof is there - and I even gave you the links.

Regards
Thomas

Re: Firewall newbie! Which free one??

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Re: Firewall newbie! Which free one??

Leythos schrieb:

> Ok, lets take it from your angle:
>
> 1) Windows XP does not make an effective firewall because it permits
> user applications to control it

agree. Windows XP does not make any firewall at all. It includes an
inbound packet filter that may be part of a firewall and may just as
well be not.
>
> 2) Third-Party firewalls may let user applications control it, so it's
> not effective

I assume you are talking about so called personal firewalls. If so,
correct. For me, a firewall that deserves this name is more than just a
software product running on the host to be protected.
>
> 3) Windows XP Firewall does not provide for ANY real-time traffic
> display, so it's useless.

It seems to be pretty effective when it comes to blocking incoming
traffic. I would not call it a firewall, but it is doing ok for this
specific purpose.

> 4) Most PFW solutions provide for real-time traffic display (and I'm not
> talking about apps, just traffic), so they are better than XP Firewall.

No. They show the traffic they can detect. As an example they will not
display any traffic that $malware tunnels through your browser because
for them browser traffic is legitimate. After all, you allowed IE to
access the net - or maybe Firefox :-)
>
> Show me where the specific statements I've made a incorrect.

See my comments on 4)

regards
Thomas

Re: Firewall newbie! Which free one??

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Re: Firewall newbie! Which free one??

Duane Arnold wrote:

> I read alright only to find out that you're a dumbass home user running
> off about the your stupid mouth and some persoanl packet filter.
>
> Duane

You didn't read one thing I typed correctly. If you had read correctly
you would have seen that I don't use any firewall with outbound
protection. Oh, and anyone who gives credibility to a spyware supporter
needs to wise up quick.

Re: Firewall newbie! Which free one??

Garrot wrote:
> Duane Arnold wrote:
>
>> I read alright only to find out that you're a dumbass home user
>> running off about the your stupid mouth and some persoanl packet filter.
>>
>> Duane
>
>
> You didn't read one thing I typed correctly. If you had read correctly
> you would have seen that I don't use any firewall with outbound
> protection. Oh, and anyone who gives credibility to a spyware supporter
> needs to wise up quick.

Go fuck yourself boy, you're a *clown*.

Duane

Re: Firewall newbie! Which free one??

One other thing, you should have your mama take your computer away from
you. You don't deserve one. Now, you go stand in your corner in the crib
and play with all your toys.

Duane

Re: Firewall newbie! Which free one??

Duane Arnold wrote:
> One other thing, you should have your mama take your computer away from
> you. You don't deserve one. Now, you go stand in your corner in the crib
> and play with all your toys.
>
> Duane

Awww...poor wittle Duane has his panties in a twist. MISSION ACCOMPLISHED!

Re: Firewall newbie! Which free one??

Garrot wrote:
> Duane Arnold wrote:
>
>> One other thing, you should have your mama take your computer away
>> from you. You don't deserve one. Now, you go stand in your corner in
>> the crib and play with all your toys.
>>
>> Duane
>
>
> Awww...poor wittle Duane has his panties in a twist. MISSION ACCOMPLISHED!

Awww poor little Garrot aka 007-Carrot Spyware Secret Agent. He's always
on the lookout for the nasty *developer* that wrote some software that's
going to steal 007-Carrot Spyware Secret Agent's sole.

But why did 007-Carrot Spyware Secret Agent install the software in the
first place? He's the one that went paranoid after he installed the
software on his little computer has he sat there in the corner of his crib.

The boy's mama said, "you should listen to your mama you never do,
therefore, you installed the software from the evil and nasty developer
and it's your problem. I should tell you daddy and let him beat your ass
again. Maybe you'll listen to somebody for once.".

As 007-Carrot Spyware Secret Agent stood in the corner of his crib and
watched his mama walk away pissed, Little Carrot aka 007-Carrot Spyware
Secret Agent said under his voice, "go fuck yourself and daddy too,
because I am 007-Carrot Spyware Secret Agent and it's my crib."

There is no moral to the story.

It's just everyday life in the crib for Garrot aka 007-Carrot Spyware
Secret Agent.

Thank ya thank ya very much. Thank ya thank ya very much!

EOR ;-)

Duane :)

Re: Firewall newbie! Which free one??

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Re: Firewall newbie! Which free one??

Duane Arnold wrote:

> Awww poor little Garrot aka 007-Carrot Spyware Secret Agent. He's always
> on the lookout for the nasty *developer* that wrote some software that's
> going to steal 007-Carrot Spyware Secret Agent's sole.
>
> But why did 007-Carrot Spyware Secret Agent install the software in the
> first place? He's the one that went paranoid after he installed the
> software on his little computer has he sat there in the corner of his crib.
>
> The boy's mama said, "you should listen to your mama you never do,
> therefore, you installed the software from the evil and nasty developer
> and it's your problem. I should tell you daddy and let him beat your ass
> again. Maybe you'll listen to somebody for once.".
>
> As 007-Carrot Spyware Secret Agent stood in the corner of his crib and
> watched his mama walk away pissed, Little Carrot aka 007-Carrot Spyware
> Secret Agent said under his voice, "go fuck yourself and daddy too,
> because I am 007-Carrot Spyware Secret Agent and it's my crib."
>
> There is no moral to the story.
>
> It's just everyday life in the crib for Garrot aka 007-Carrot Spyware
> Secret Agent.
>
> Thank ya thank ya very much. Thank ya thank ya very much!
>
> EOR ;-)
>
> Duane :)

Duane, once again you have a reading comprehension problem. Where did I
say I installed any of the software mentioned? I don't have any of the
"spyware" mentioned installed any any of my PC's. Remedial reading class
101 for you, sonny. The point I am making, that you fail to comprehend,
is that the surreptitious behavior of those programs can be controlled
with a firewall like Kerio but not with the XP firewall. Wake up and
smell the coffee.

Re: Firewall newbie! Which free one??

Leythos wrote:

> You misunderstood what I said again - REAL_TIME MONITORING - there is
> nothing to see in Windows Firewall for ports being used.

Then get a port monitor.

Re: Firewall newbie! Which free one??

Leythos schrieb:

> In article <1157742483.802360.146580@i3g2000cwc.googlegroups.com>,
> thomas.hertel@gmx.net says...

> You misunderstood what I said again - REAL_TIME MONITORING - there is
> nothing to see in Windows Firewall for ports being used.

What is real time monitoring? Once your monitor shows you something,
this has happened in the past. You cannot do anything about it any
more.
>
> > > 4) Most PFW solutions provide for real-time traffic display (and I'm not
> > > talking about apps, just traffic), so they are better than XP Firewall.
> >
> > No. They show the traffic they can detect. As an example they will not
> > display any traffic that $malware tunnels through your browser because
> > for them browser traffic is legitimate. After all, you allowed IE to
> > access the net - or maybe Firefox :-)
>
> Wrong, again, they show traffic, some of them, by port, not application.
> I don't care what uses IE, permitted or not, as I don't care about
> possible application control, again, it's about what ports are in use
> ONLY.

And what do you think is it that uses ports. Maybe applications?

> Stop thinking application control, think port control only.

I have never thought about application control. I was actually trying
to explain that this cannot work.

Regards
Thomas

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Re: Firewall newbie! Which free one??

Garrot wrote:
> Duane Arnold wrote:
>
>> Awww poor little Garrot aka 007-Carrot Spyware Secret Agent. He's
>> always on the lookout for the nasty *developer* that wrote some
>> software that's going to steal 007-Carrot Spyware Secret Agent's sole.
>>
>> But why did 007-Carrot Spyware Secret Agent install the software in
>> the first place? He's the one that went paranoid after he installed
>> the software on his little computer has he sat there in the corner of
>> his crib.
>>
>> The boy's mama said, "you should listen to your mama you never do,
>> therefore, you installed the software from the evil and nasty
>> developer and it's your problem. I should tell you daddy and let him
>> beat your ass again. Maybe you'll listen to somebody for once.".
>>
>> As 007-Carrot Spyware Secret Agent stood in the corner of his crib and
>> watched his mama walk away pissed, Little Carrot aka 007-Carrot
>> Spyware Secret Agent said under his voice, "go fuck yourself and daddy
>> too, because I am 007-Carrot Spyware Secret Agent and it's my crib."
>>
>> There is no moral to the story.
>>
>> It's just everyday life in the crib for Garrot aka 007-Carrot Spyware
>> Secret Agent.
>>
>> Thank ya thank ya very much. Thank ya thank ya very much!
>>
>> EOR ;-)
>>
>> Duane :)
>
>
> Duane, once again you have a reading comprehension problem. Where did I
> say I installed any of the software mentioned?

Yeah, Yeah little Garrot aka 007-Carrot Spyware Secret Agent go tell
your mama what you're doing. You can through your bottle out of the crib
too. Maybe, that will get someone's attention.

> I don't have any of the
> "spyware" mentioned installed any any of my PC's. Remedial reading class
> 101 for you, sonny. The point I am making, that you fail to comprehend,
> is that the surreptitious behavior of those programs can be controlled
> with a firewall like Kerio but not with the XP firewall. Wake up and
> smell the coffee.

I guess it's mission accomplished. Where the hell is the fucking secret
list about the *developers* and more spyware, boy? I need you to go on
about the list. I needles me some CD's so that I can grind me up some
spyware dust and sprinkle a little bit around.

That way, I can pull you in some more and have a little fun, 007-Carrot
Spyware Secret Agent.

If anyone is miss reading anything around here boy, it's you ;-), as I
baited the arrow with a little sypware dust and shot the arrow into the
sky and little old Garrot aka 007-Carrot Spyware Secret Agent took off
with his 007 Spyware Secret Agent Big Wheel and went after it. :)

I hate to see you under pressure in a real cross examination, as you
might crack under the pressure and give it all up. ;-)

EOR

Duane :)

Re: Firewall newbie! Which free one??

> The point I am making, that you fail to comprehend,
> is that the surreptitious behavior of those programs can be controlled
> with a firewall like Kerio but not with the XP firewall. Wake up and
> smell the coffee.

I have heard your worthless little spill before Little Garrot aka
007-Carrot Spyware Secret Agent, since coming to this NG back in 2000.
I have moved past the BS little PFW/or what I like to call them personal
packet filters that are not FW(s) and some damn App Control in them,
that can be circumvented and defeated. I don't lean on such snake-oil
like you do.

I am even using a personal packet filter with your beloved App Control
from this hotel room while on the road contracting as a *developer*. But
your beloved App Control is disable in this solution as it's worthless
to me and I don't need it. It only stops unsolicited inbound traffic
which is not unlike the XP's personal packet solution.

However, I use an element that's on the XP pro O/S that is a packet
filter too that can stop inbound or outbound traffic by port, protocol
or IP to supplement the personal packet filter. It too has logging like
the personal packet filter that's running on the machine.

Read boy and read it well.

http://www.petri.co.il/block_ping_traffic_with_ipsec.htm
http://support.microsoft.com/kb/813878

I use the AnalogX rules with adjustments in the rules for my needs to
supplement the personal packet filter.

http://www.analogx.com/contents/articles/ipsec.htm

The buck stops with the O/S, it don't stop anywhere else for me. I know
how to go to the O/S and control what is to run and what's not to run.
My personal packet filter with it's worthless snake-oil App Control is
not responsible for anything other than to *block* unsolicited inbound
traffic to the machine, when my machine is not behind my FW appliance,
which is turned off when the machine is behind the FW appliance.

I know how to use the proper tools like TCPview, Active Ports and
Process Explorer, etc, etc and look for myself as to what is happening
on my machines. If something is running on my machines that I don't want
running or doing something, I don't run it and I remove it from my
machines or don't install it period.

In the mean time, you continue to lean on your solution like a crutch
and stand up in the NG and try to preach about it.

Boy, I have been in the IT field since 1971 when Apple was in a wooden
box. I am pretty sure I have done more and seen more with computers and
software including being a software developer since 1980, than you have
been alive.

I just wanted to see what path on the Yellow Brick road you would take
as I sprinkled spyware dust in your nose. ;-)

You go boy! I know you have said to your PFW that it's great, you're
great and therefore, you both are great.

EOR specialist -- that's Equal Opportunity Ragger to you boy and the
deadly game of ragging. You jumped right out of your crib with a loose
Pamper. ;-)

Duane :)

Re: Firewall newbie! Which free one??

Duane Arnold wrote:

> I have heard your worthless little spill before Little Garrot aka
> 007-Carrot Spyware Secret Agent,

Stop frothing at the mouth like a rabid dog and take some valium. The
fact you keep posting twice to me proves that you have lost the
argument. Next!

Re: Firewall newbie! Which free one??

Garrot wrote:
> Duane Arnold wrote:
>
>> I have heard your worthless little spill before Little Garrot aka
>> 007-Carrot Spyware Secret Agent,
>
>
> Stop frothing at the mouth like a rabid dog and take some valium. The
> fact you keep posting twice to me proves that you have lost the
> argument. Next!

What argument are you talking about, boy? What's wrong with you, boy?

There is no argument boy other than you standing up on your soapbox with
spyware dust in your nose, Agent. And you made it very *clear* as to
what you are and there is no argument there, that you're a dumb ass
with the home user part left out.

You said a couple of sentences about spyware and you keep running off
about your mouth about a personal packet filter. It tickles me to no
end that people the Internet need a discussion or argument. You can have
it with yourself boy.

And besides boy, you foamed at the mouth first about your *fucking*
list. That's really all this about*boy* for me is you foaming about the
mouth with me. The rest of this is just icing on the cake for me.

All I am doing is having a little fun with the rag game. And you bit
again little Garrot 007-Carrot Spyware Secret Agent. You're the one
that's standing up in the NG like a lunatic making something out of nothing.

Stop acting like a little *clown* and have your mama put some Riddlin
and a couple of Prozac in your formula. You can have a bottle on me and
then you can lay down. ;-)

Duane :)

Re: Firewall newbie! Which free one??

Here boy, I made a second post. Let's see if you'll bite. ;-)

Duane :)

Re: Firewall newbie! Which free one??

Duane & Garrot...

Can't we all just get along?

....Kum Ba Ya My Lord... Kum Ba Ya....

I used to know a guy who had two dogs who were the best of friends. He would
rub their noses together though and a massive fight would ensue....

C'mon now.... Let's stick to comp.security.firewalls... You two can blow
kisses at one another somewhere else...

Seriously though you both had some valid points...

What do I know about computer security you ask? Just enough to be
paranoid...

;)

Re: Firewall newbie! Which free one??

>
> C'mon now.... Let's stick to comp.security.firewalls... You two can blow
> kisses at one another somewhere else...

The only kiss 007-Carrot would get would be the kiss of the grill on the
front of my GMC Jimmy as I ran him down in street traffic as he played.
I might go around the block and let the Jimmy kiss him again on GP to
make sure. ;-)

Duane :)