[site] proposed changes

Back on a kick to clean up the site a bit more.

Removals:
1. Remove the faqs page. It's getting low on content.
2. Vendor support. This is getting increasingly threadbare - so
raising the removal of this again. Content to be moved to the Wiki.
3. Removal of the JSPA Agreement link. It's very dated - however
there are a few historical sites linking to the page, so I'd not
remove the page yet.
4. Acknowledgements. I don't think we need to link to this.
5. Translation sites. They can't keep up, time to go I think.
6. Reference Library. Move this to the Wiki.
7. 'Jakarta Webmaster' link from the contact us page.

+1s/-1s?

I'll wait 'til Friday to do whatever bits haven't been -1'd.

Hen

Re: [site] proposed changes

Henri Yandell schrieb:
> Back on a kick to clean up the site a bit more.
>
> Removals:
> 1. Remove the faqs page. It's getting low on content.

+1

> 2. Vendor support. This is getting increasingly threadbare - so
> raising the removal of this again. Content to be moved to the Wiki.

+1

> 3. Removal of the JSPA Agreement link. It's very dated - however
> there are a few historical sites linking to the page, so I'd not
> remove the page yet.

+1

> 4. Acknowledgements. I don't think we need to link to this.

+0 (i.e. I don't care)

> 5. Translation sites. They can't keep up, time to go I think.

+1

> 6. Reference Library. Move this to the Wiki.

+1

> 7. 'Jakarta Webmaster' link from the contact us page.

+1

Ciao
Henning


--
Henning P. Schmiedehausen -- hps@intermeta.de | J2EE, Linux
91054 Buckenhof, Germany -- +49 9131 506540 | Apache person
Open Source Consulting, Development, Design | Velocity - Turbine

"Save the cheerleader. Save the world."

Re: [site] proposed changes

> 2. Vendor support. This is getting increasingly threadbare - so
> raising the removal of this again. Content to be moved to the Wiki.

Why not just move all of the content of all of these pages to the wiki and
change the links.
Or better still have a section of "wiki links" in the right hand nav for
them.

d.


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Re: [site] proposed changes

Hi,

On 12/3/06, Henri Yandell wrote:
> 1. Remove the faqs page. It's getting low on content.

+1.

> 2. Vendor support. This is getting increasingly threadbare - so
> raising the removal of this again. Content to be moved to the Wiki.

+1.

> 3. Removal of the JSPA Agreement link. It's very dated - however
> there are a few historical sites linking to the page, so I'd not
> remove the page yet.

+1 to not removing it. +1 to putting a big bold notice at the top of
the page saying this page is deprecated and slated for removal. We'll
leave the notice up there a while.

> 4. Acknowledgements. I don't think we need to link to this.

+1.

> 5. Translation sites. They can't keep up, time to go I think.

Mmm, this is the only item I have a bit of an issue with. The
translators are volunteers jut like us, and their efforts, even if
incomplete, are hugely valuable to those people with lower mastery of
English. I'd hate to remove these links. +1 to putting up a notice
on the site that these links are maintained by volunteers, are not
ASF/official, and may be out of date. -0 to removing the links
altogether.

> 6. Reference Library. Move this to the Wiki.

+1.

> 7. 'Jakarta Webmaster' link from the contact us page.

+1.

Yoav

Re: [site] proposed changes

On 12/4/06, Danny Angus wrote:
> > 2. Vendor support. This is getting increasingly threadbare - so
> > raising the removal of this again. Content to be moved to the Wiki.
>
> Why not just move all of the content of all of these pages to the wiki and
> change the links.
> Or better still have a section of "wiki links" in the right hand nav for
> them.

Linking to pages in the wiki is bad, I think. When a page in a wiki
has reached a point of wanting to be individually linked to, then I
think that's a sign that it wants to be on the site.

These pages are all ones that have less value than the screen real
estate they take up, so definitely wouldn't want to keep the links.

Hen

Re: [site] proposed changes

>>
>> Why not just move all of the content of all of these pages to the
>> wiki and
>> change the links.
>> Or better still have a section of "wiki links" in the right hand nav for
>> them.
>
> Linking to pages in the wiki is bad, I think. When a page in a wiki
> has reached a point of wanting to be individually linked to, then I
> think that's a sign that it wants to be on the site.

I actually favor the idea of the whole site being a wiki. I see little
value from hand coding the

tags and wanking around with the tools to
build it. Then the process for structuring the site is democratized
and the process for generating the consensus and structuring the site
will be closer to the metal.
However, I've never been much of one for ceremony.


-Andy

Re: [site] proposed changes

On 12/4/06, Andrew C. Oliver wrote:
>
> >>
> >> Why not just move all of the content of all of these pages to the
> >> wiki and
> >> change the links.
> >> Or better still have a section of "wiki links" in the right hand nav for
> >> them.
> >
> > Linking to pages in the wiki is bad, I think. When a page in a wiki
> > has reached a point of wanting to be individually linked to, then I
> > think that's a sign that it wants to be on the site.
>
> I actually favor the idea of the whole site being a wiki. I see little
> value from hand coding the

tags and wanking around with the tools to
> build it. Then the process for structuring the site is democratized
> and the process for generating the consensus and structuring the site
> will be closer to the metal.

A wiki as in our moinmoin setup - ie) classic anarchy/randomness; or a
wiki as in the cwiki confluence approach of site generation?

The former always seems to be painful when I've seen sites trying it
(from a user point of view at least); I think because it's still very
obviously a wiki and unpolished. The latter just seems to continue the
tool masturbation.

Maybe it's a case of not noticing when a site is using a wiki well. I
only notice the crap ones.

> However, I've never been much of one for ceremony.

If we're on the I'd likes....

I'd like the Jakarta site to be an xml file(s) with a bunch of xslt's.
Then I'd like each subproject/component to be product documentation
sites and not waste time with infrastructure (the jakarta site can
take care of all that) and I'd like a separate developer focused site
for each subproject/component that is refreshed automatically each
night.

Hen

Re: [site] proposed changes

Hi,

(I am subscribing to "general-digest" list ... so, perhaps
this is too late ...)

> 5. Translation sites. They can't keep up, time to go I think.

-1

-- Tetsuya (tetsuya@apache.org)

P.S. Plus, I personally think that "Apache DB" also can
be listed to "Ex-Jakarta" ... because some of the subprojects
in Apache DB "once" were in Jakarta (precisely, OJB and Torque).


----

> Back on a kick to clean up the site a bit more.
>
> Removals:
> 1. Remove the faqs page. It's getting low on content.
> 2. Vendor support. This is getting increasingly threadbare - so
> raising the removal of this again. Content to be moved to the Wiki.
> 3. Removal of the JSPA Agreement link. It's very dated - however
> there are a few historical sites linking to the page, so I'd not
> remove the page yet.
> 4. Acknowledgements. I don't think we need to link to this.
> 5. Translation sites. They can't keep up, time to go I think.
> 6. Reference Library. Move this to the Wiki.
> 7. 'Jakarta Webmaster' link from the contact us page.
>
> +1s/-1s?
>
> I'll wait 'til Friday to do whatever bits haven't been -1'd.
>
> Hen


------------------------------------------------------------ ---------
Tetsuya Kitahata -- Terra-International, Inc. - President -
E-mail: kitahata@terra-intl.com http://www.terra-intl.com/

Re: [site] proposed changes

On 12/3/06, Henri Yandell wrote:
> Back on a kick to clean up the site a bit more.
>
> Removals:
> 1. Remove the faqs page. It's getting low on content.

Done.

> 2. Vendor support. This is getting increasingly threadbare - so
> raising the removal of this again. Content to be moved to the Wiki.

Here's the list of vendors:

3GS LLC - No website provided. The obvious link specifies nothing
related to open source.

Multitask - An automotive solutions provider.

Cafesoft - Provider of the Cams Single Sign On product.

JAMM Consulting - Nothing related to open source on site.

Open Input - Spanish site, so unsure, but looks more open source
related than anything so far. Nothing Jakarta related though that I
can tell.

OpenWeb - This mentions something Jakarta based! Jyve :) So quite a dated site.

Sono - Nothing Jakarta/open-source based. Copyright on site is 2003,
though that doesn't imply it isn't still active.

Superlink - Supports POI. Our first valid vendor support link.

Tachometry - Product name of OpenVelocity (not related) is confusing
from our end, they use Tomcat and mention open source a lot, but
nothing to suggest anything Jakarta focused.

XPLG - Log product company. Ties to log4j.

So apart from SuperLink, there's nothing that even makes sense to be
on our vendor support page, and only a couple who could be argued in
that direction based on a java@apache point of view (Open Input,
XPLG).

Thoughts? Andy, on behalf of SuperLink any thoughts on whether you'd
want a wiki page with SuperLink as the only entry?

> 3. Removal of the JSPA Agreement link. It's very dated - however
> there are a few historical sites linking to the page, so I'd not
> remove the page yet.

Done.

> 4. Acknowledgements. I don't think we need to link to this.

Done.

> 5. Translation sites. They can't keep up, time to go I think.

-1'd so not doing.

> 6. Reference Library. Move this to the Wiki.

Done.

> 7. 'Jakarta Webmaster' link from the contact us page.

Done.


Hen

Re: [site] proposed changes

On 12/8/06, tetsuya@apache.org wrote:

> > 5. Translation sites. They can't keep up, time to go I think.
>
> -1

I think this is an interesting one, perhaps we should think about
setting standards for translation sites which might let us feel more
comfortable linking to. along the lines of the mirrors standards..
http://www.apache.org/info/how-to-mirror.html

d.