For example, I know a domain "xx.com" which has a relay server, I
connect
to that relay server WITHOUT authorization and send an email to any
account in that domain and it works 100%.
Is this possible with any domain, like hotmail?
Nad
> For example, I know a domain "xx.com" which has a relay server, I
>connect
> to that relay server WITHOUT authorization and send an email to any
> account in that domain and it works 100%.
It may have worked for you because you are already authorised to use
the server. If "xx.com" is actually your ISP, then the fact that you
are on one of their IP numbers may be enough to authorise you. If it
is a domain where you have a pop3 account, the fact that you've
checked your pop3 mail box shortly before attempting the send may be
enough to authorise you. Or it may be that you have stumbled across an
open relay set up by an incompetent system admin who shouldn't even be
allowed to play with Lego bricks.
Using this open relay may work to send mail but whether people at the
other end receive it or not is another matter. Most mail servers
operating as open relays are quickly detected and added to blacklists,
and many mail admins these days use those blacklists to reject all
mail sent from open relay mail servers.
Your posting also raises questions as to why you would want to be able
to mail via other people's servers without authorisation. In the
absence of a very good explanation, I think we'd be justified in
thinking you wanted to abuse the email service in some way.
This is a MIME GnuPG-signed message. If you see this text, it means that
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To open this message correctly you will need to install E-mail or Usenet
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Nad writes:
> For example, I know a domain "xx.com" which has a relay server, I
> connect
> to that relay server WITHOUT authorization and send an email to any
> account in that domain and it works 100%.
>
> Is this possible with any domain, like hotmail?
Of course it is. If Hotmail requires authorization before accepting mail for
a Hotmail account, exactly how do you propose the rest of the Internet go
about getting the necessary authorization to deliver mail to Hotmail?
Use any domain in place of Hotmail, the question remains the same.
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Sam
> Of course it is.....
I see now I've read your response that the guy isn't talking about
using a third-party server as an open relay, but about simply sending
mail to a domain and I've completely misunderstood what he was asking.
I guess the answer is so blindingly obvious that my brain couldn't
conceive it as a question.
Landmark
>... waffle
Ignore all that. I thought you were talking about using another domain
as an open relay, rather than simply sending mail to their mail
servers.
However, if you are sending mail from your desktop PC to my mailbox
then there is a very good chance you will be blocked anyway because
you are sending from a residential IP number. The bulk of spam these
days is sent by botnets using residential IP numbers, not via mail
servers, so it is a very good indicator of spam.
On Apr 10, 7:05=A0am, Sam
> Nad writes:
> > =A0For example, I know a domain "xx.com" which has a relay server, I
> > connect
> > =A0to that relay server WITHOUT authorization and send an email to any
> > =A0account in that domain and it works 100%.
>
> > Is this possible with any domain, like hotmail?
>
> Of course it is. If Hotmail requires authorization before accepting mail f=
or
> a Hotmail account, exactly how do you propose the rest of the Internet go
> about getting the necessary authorization to deliver mail to Hotmail?
>
> Use any domain in place of Hotmail, the question remains the same.
>
> =A0application_pgp-signature_part
> 1KDownload
OK. How to implement this for HOTMAIL?
I used TELNET to send an email message.
This is a MIME GnuPG-signed message. If you see this text, it means that
your E-mail or Usenet software does not support MIME signed messages.
The Internet standard for MIME PGP messages, RFC 2015, was published in 1996.
To open this message correctly you will need to install E-mail or Usenet
software that supports modern Internet standards.
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Nad writes:
> On Apr 10, 7:05Â am, Sam
>> Nad writes:
>> > Â For example, I know a domain "xx.com" which has a relay server=
, I
>> > connect
>> > Â to that relay server WITHOUT authorization and send an email t=
o any
>> > Â account in that domain and it works 100%.
>>
>> > Is this possible with any domain, like hotmail?
>>
>> Of course it is. If Hotmail requires authorization before accepting ma=
il for
>> a Hotmail account, exactly how do you propose the rest of the Internet =
go
>> about getting the necessary authorization to deliver mail to Hotmail?
>>
>> Use any domain in place of Hotmail, the question remains the same.
>>
>> Â application_pgp-signature_part
>> 1KDownload
>=20
> OK. How to implement this for HOTMAIL?
> I used TELNET to send an email message.
I would like to honestly ask the following question, and I am being=20
completely serious:
What the FUCK are you talking about?
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On Thu, 10 Apr 2008 19:38:45 -0500, Sam
>> OK. How to implement this for HOTMAIL?
>> I used TELNET to send an email message.
>
>I would like to honestly ask the following question, and I am being
>completely serious:
>
>What the FUCK are you talking about?
I think he wants you to talk about MX records. You've come this far,
so...
--
Steve Baker
Nad wrote:
> For example, I know a domain "xx.com" which has a relay server, I
> connect to that relay server WITHOUT authorization and send an email
> to any account in that domain and it works 100%.
No kidding...
> Is this possible with any domain, like hotmail?
Uh... yes.
If you want your computer to send out lots of mail, follow these
easy steps:
1) Install Windows.
2) Connect to the Internet.
3) Wait.
4) Your computer will shortly become part of a botnet sending out billions
of e-mails. Congratulations!
Note that substituting "Linux" for "Windows" in step (1) will cause
failure. No substitutions are permitted.
-- David.
On Apr 10, 9:35=A0pm, Steve Baker
> On Thu, 10 Apr 2008 19:38:45 -0500, Sam
> >> OK. How to implement this for HOTMAIL?
> >> I used TELNET to send an email message.
>
> >I would like to honestly ask the following question, and I am being
> >completely serious:
>
> >What the FUCK are you talking about?
>
> =A0 I think he wants you to talk about MX records. You've come this far,
> so...
>
> --
> Steve Baker
I am not trying to send spams or any, so why are the insults?
I just want to know if this really aplies to all servers?
Why then can HOTMAIL, for example, send emails to any servers and the
message is received and when sent from a normal PC, the message is
rejected ?
Nad
>Why then can HOTMAIL, for example, send emails to any servers and the
>message is received and when sent from a normal PC, the message is
>rejected ?
One reason could be because you are trying to send from Residential IP
space, or a dynamically assigned IP number. That is characteristic of
spambot behaviour. You may be trying to use an email address which,
according to SPF records, you are not authorised to use. You may be
using an IP address which is already on blacklists for abusive
behaviour. You may be magling the Helo commands. Maybe you are not
followign the right protocols. You are posting from Chile and maybe
mail servers just don't like getting mail from Chile. Should I
continue?
I would be more interested to know why you are trying to do this at
all when you surely have a perfectly good email client already, and an
SMTP channel supplied by your own ISP? What reason do you have for not
using the ISP's service?
> I would be more interested to know why you are trying to do this at
> all when you surely have a perfectly good email client already, and an
> SMTP channel supplied by your own ISP? What reason do you have for not
> using the ISP's service?
The domain I am sending to is not my ISP domain at all, I just wanted
to KNOW 2 things:
1) Do all email servers have relaying server available?
2) How does the relaying server or email server accept the message
when it is coming from hotmail, yahoo and reject it when sent from a
PC, does it contain a big listo of those IPs ?
That's all!
Nad wrote:
>> I would be more interested to know why you are trying to do this at
>> all when you surely have a perfectly good email client already, and an
>> SMTP channel supplied by your own ISP? What reason do you have for not
>> using the ISP's service?
>
> The domain I am sending to is not my ISP domain at all, I just wanted
> to KNOW 2 things:
>
> 1) Do all email servers have relaying server available?
No. In fact *no* email server should have an open relay. ("Open Relay"
means something that just anyone can connect to and send email, open
relays "help" SPAM to propagate.)
> 2) How does the relaying server or email server accept the message
> when it is coming from hotmail, yahoo and reject it when sent from a
> PC, does it contain a big listo of those IPs ?
The server usually has a list of *networks* it will accept mail for
relay from, rather than a list of individual IP addresses. (But it
could have IP addresses as well, I suppose.)
This can be extended by some form of "logging in" to the server, too.
Cheers,
Gary B-)
--
____________________________________________________________ __________________
Armful of chairs: Something some people would not know
whether you were up them with or not
- Barry Humphries
Nad
>The domain I am sending to is not my ISP domain at all, I just wanted
>to KNOW 2 things:
I don't think you are understanding how SMTP works. Whatever domain
you are trying to send to, you should normally be using your own ISP's
outgoing SMTP server (or one that you own/operate yourself), not
connecting direct to the remote servers. The overwhelming majority of
direct connection attempts from private IP space these days are from
botnets attempting to send spam and are therefore quite rightly
rejected by many mail servers. You still haven't offered any
explanation of why you are trying to do this so I'm still thinking you
have ideas of writing yourself a spamming engine or something.
>1) Do all email servers have relaying server available?
Way back at the start of this thread, Sam pointed out that, of
necessity, all mail servers must accept mail for their domain from
strangers, without the need for a password. Otherwise it would be
impossible for people to send email to that domain. When a server
accepts mail for its own domains, that it not the same as it accepting
mail for forwarding to other domains. A well run mail server should
only accept mail for forwarding to other domains from users who are
authorized in some way, e.g. who have supplied a username and
password.
When you toss in words like "relaying" it may sound to you like you
are using the jargon and appearing knowledgeable but all you are doing
is creating confusion. You should make sure you know what everyone
else means by terms like relaying before you start using it in your
questions, or better still, not use jargon at all.
>2) How does the relaying server or email server accept the message
>when it is coming from hotmail, yahoo and reject it when sent from a
>PC, does it contain a big listo of those IPs ?
Once again, this term relaying is making a nonsense of your question,
but aside from that, did I not give a whole slew of possible
explanations for this in the previous post? Geez, you've got reading
difficulties, and you are trying to telnet into other people's SMTP
servers without having understood how SMTP works,.... is it any
surprise that people are blocking you?
On Apr 12, 6:55=A0am, Landmark
> Nad
> >The domain I am sending to is not my ISP domain at all, I just wanted
> >to KNOW 2 things:
>
> I don't think you are understanding how SMTP works. Whatever domain
> you are trying to send to, you should normally be using your own ISP's
> outgoing SMTP server (or one that you own/operate yourself), not
> connecting direct to the remote servers. The overwhelming majority of
> direct connection attempts from private IP space these days are from
> botnets attempting to send spam and are therefore quite rightly
> rejected by many mail servers. You still haven't offered any
> explanation of why you are trying to do this so I'm still thinking you
> have ideas of writing yourself a spamming engine or something.
>
> >1) Do all email servers have relaying server available?
>
> Way back at the start of this thread, Sam pointed out that, of
> necessity, all mail servers must accept mail for their domain from
> strangers, without the need for a password. Otherwise it would be
> impossible for people to send email to that domain. When a server
> accepts mail for its own domains, that it not the same as it accepting
> mail for forwarding to other domains. A well run mail server should
> only accept mail for forwarding to other domains from users who are
> authorized in some way, e.g. who have supplied a username and
> password.
>
> When you toss in words like "relaying" it may sound to you like you
> are using the jargon and appearing knowledgeable but all you are doing
> is creating confusion. You should make sure you know what everyone
> else means by terms like relaying before you start using it in your
> questions, or better still, not use jargon at all.
>
> >2) How does the relaying server or email server accept the message
> >when it is coming from hotmail, yahoo and reject it when sent from a
> >PC, does it contain a big listo of those IPs ?
>
> Once again, this term relaying is making a nonsense of your question,
> but aside from that, did I not give a whole slew of possible
> explanations for this in the previous post? Geez, you've got reading
> difficulties, and you are trying to telnet into other people's SMTP
> servers without having understood how SMTP works,.... is it any
> surprise that people are blocking you?
Yest, I understand now.
Actually I was asking for all this because a month ago, I started
receiving alerts from my Norton Firewall, saying that a message is
being sent directly from my PC, and I saw many popups appearing every
second, I didn't know what happened. After checking I found a prcoess
running which was causing all this. It was sending mails from my PC
to many accounts like hotmail, yahoo, ..etc, I did not know that this
was possible or if the messages really arrived, I started finding out
using a testing server at my school, and I could successfully send a
message to any address in their domain without AUTH, and I alerted
them. I am not trying to send SPAM at ALL. So I started asking here to
know what is going on and maybe it is a problem in configuration.
But you always prejudged me and insisted that I am trying to send
spam!
Anyway, Thanks a lot for your explanation!!
Nad wrote:
> Actually I was asking for all this because a month ago, I started
> receiving alerts from my Norton Firewall, saying that a message is
> being sent directly from my PC, and I saw many popups appearing every
> second, I didn't know what happened. After checking I found a prcoess
> running which was causing all this. It was sending mails from my PC
> to many accounts like hotmail, yahoo,
Welcome to Windows. Your computer is now probably part of a botnet,
being rented by the hour to spammers.
You'd better get it cleaned, preferably by removing Windows.
Regards,
David.
"David F. Skoll" wrote:
> If you want your computer to send out lots of mail, follow these
> easy steps:
> 1) Install Windows.
1) Install Windows NT, 2K or XP.
> 2) Connect to the Internet.
>
> 3) Wait.
3) Wait.
The time to wait is known as the "internet survival time" and
can vary but is usually between 5 and 60 minutes.
> 4) Your computer will shortly become part of a botnet sending
> out billions of e-mails. Congratulations!
>
> Note that substituting "Linux" for "Windows" in step (1) will cause
> failure. No substitutions are permitted.
Substituting "Linux" for "Windows" or "9x" for "NT, 2K or XP" in step
(1) will cause failure.
On Apr 14, 9:56=A0pm, Spam Guy
> "David F. Skoll" wrote:
> > If you want your computer to send out lots of mail, follow these
> > easy steps:
> > 1) Install Windows.
>
> 1) Install Windows NT, 2K or XP.
>
> > 2) Connect to the Internet.
>
> > 3) Wait.
>
> 3) Wait. =A0
> =A0 =A0The time to wait is known as the "internet survival time" and
> =A0 =A0can vary but is usually between 5 and 60 minutes.
>
> > 4) Your computer will shortly become part of a botnet sending
> > =A0 =A0out billions of e-mails. =A0Congratulations!
>
> > Note that substituting "Linux" for "Windows" in step (1) will cause
> > failure. =A0No substitutions are permitted.
>
> Substituting "Linux" for "Windows" or "9x" for "NT, 2K or XP" in step
> (1) will cause failure.
Well, this is not always true.
If you know what you are doing you, then nothing can infect you. I
removed this trojan at once!!